Gail McDonald sits down with Dr. Joel Rothaizer, MCC, ABPP. He’s a Board Certified Psychologist, a Master Certified Coach through the International Coaching Federation, and a long-time executive coach. Together we explore the surprising overlap between coaching and psychology — and why coaches can safely borrow powerful techniques without crossing ethical lines. With more than 30 years of experience supporting leaders and organizations, Dr. Rothaizer shares practical, grounded insights that help coaches deepen their impact while staying firmly within scope.

In this rich conversation, Gail and Dr. Rothaizer unpack the origins of the “coaching vs. therapy” divide, the false dichotomies that still influence the profession, and why the real foundation of both practices is the same: creating a safe, trusting environment where clients can be vulnerable, reflective, and open to change. They also explore developmental psychology, the Enneagram, emotional regulation, and how coaches can confidently navigate situations that may require referral.

This Conversation Covers:

• The false historical divide between coaching and therapy — and why it still misleads coaches

• How to create a strong “holding environment” that clients may describe as therapeutic

• The four capabilities every great executive coach needs

1. A coaching model

2. Understanding of organizational culture

3. A framework for individual differences

4. A developmental model

   • Why clients struggle to take logical next steps — and how psychology explains those barriers

   • A clear, coach-appropriate explanation of the Enneagram and its use in understanding motivation

   • When a client’s pattern points to a forward-focused coaching approach vs. a therapy referral

   • How to recognize your own “window of tolerance” during sessions and why it matters

   • The ethical red flags coaches must not ignore — and how to handle referral conversations with care

   • Why mentor coaches are essential for self-reflection, ethics, and growth

This episode is a practical, eye-opening guide to the deeper layers of human behavior that shape coaching outcomes — and a reminder that powerful coaching doesn’t require stepping into therapy, only understanding people more fully.

Dr. Joel Rothaizer, MCC, ABPP

⁠Clear Impact Leadership⁠

Book: Clear Impact: Building Your Leadership Capacity

Books & Resources Referenced:

• Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

• Internal Family Systems (IFS)

• "Window of Tolerance” framework